Which .22 for silhouette?

This is what we do.

Which .22 for silhouette?

Anschutz 1416
6
38%
CZ 452
9
56%
Remington 504
1
6%
Savage MkII BV
0
No votes
Ruger 77/22
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 16

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stsbuyer
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Re: 40X versus 1712.

Post by stsbuyer »

Jetmugg wrote:I had either forgotten or didn't realize (the mind is a terrible thing to lose) that the Rem 40X were single shot actions. Did they ever make a 40X repeater?

I have seen pics of your red, white, and blue 1712/Pharr creation on other threads. Simply beautiful.

SteveM.
Yes there were a few 40x repeaters made, too valuable to turn into a silhouette rifle. Would be interested in converting one to repeater if anyone knows of a smith that would be able to do the work.

Later, Paul
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Post by LH2 »

Went out to watch a match today (have never been to one). It was fun and good to see how things work. Now when I get my rifle & scope decided on and sighted in I know what to expect when I show up for my first match.

There were alot of Annies, several CZ's and 77/22's, a Savage bolt, Marlin 60 semiauto, some highly modded 10/22's and a couple Marlin leverguns. Didn't notice any Rem 504's or Sakos, but I didn't look at everybody's rifle up close.

Very laid back group of folks and a pretty good turn out, around 30 shooters.

I still haven't decided what rifle to buy, and after seeing the mix today, I don't think I need to drop $2k on a 1712 + scope to get started. I'll post up when I pick something out. :D
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Cold weather here....

Post by Jetmugg »

I was hoping that the weather would be decent enough to get out to a semi-local match tomorrow in Owensville, MO. However, the temperature is going to be in the single digits (F), so I'll be waiting to get out and shoot in my second-time match. The first match I shot in was a couple of weeks ago, and I'll definitely be back for more.

I have what some people call the "cheapest setup that works", which is a CZ 452 Varmint and a Weaver KT-15. I have Eric Brooks' trigger, scope blocks, and Burris signature Zee rings (for slope). I have just about $600 in the whole setup, and I'm sure that it will outshoot my abilities for years to come. I was afraid that anything cheaper in terms of a rifle or scope just wouldn't satisfy my desire for nice stuff.

I also have a 10/22 that I plan to modify the stock on, and just bought a cheap BSA 8-32X AO scope ($60 second-hand) with target knobs that I plan to put on the Ruger to use as a backup, or as a loaner to try and get more of my buddies interested in the sport.

Lots of guys here simply say "shoot what you've got". It sure is fun.

My 2 cents
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Post by dave imas »

For holy smokes sakes!!!!
everyone on here with any experience says the same thing over and over and, apparently, not everyone listens so i'll say it just one more time...
before you start thinking about which rifle and scope to buy, for pete's sake, go to a freaking match! or 2 or 3 or 4!!! try the rifles, see what people are shooting, check out what the rifles look like and how they hold. until you've actually seen or shot a rifle, what you read on here is just a bunch of hoo ha. just people's opinions that don't really mean much until you can verify it yourself. you are trying to decide which rifle you want and you haven't even shot a match yet! you don't even know if you will like silhouette shooting! and i say that because ALOT of people don't!!!! it is a very hard game that most people try once or twice and quit! maybe i'm just in a bad mood because i'm cleaning my third rifle this afternoon but holy smokes... LH2, you got the cart WAY before the horse. if necessary, i'll apologize later.
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Post by dave imas »

It has been gently brought to my attention that my last post may have been a bit mmm... indelicate? So, as I do agree, I want to apologize to LH2 for my boorish behavior.

Mr. LH2,
Please accept my apology and allow me to provide you with a beverage of your choice when first we meet. I will hence forth display more patience and tiding of fingers while vexed or in foul mood. I must, while apologizing to you, give thanks to Nomad and Chicken for their part in bringing my error to light and allowing me to be a better person.

Good fortunes upon you all and your families,

dave imas


While I'm here, a question for Kind Webmaster.

Is it possible to have a "Frequently Asked Questions" section on this forum that provides links to the threads of said questions? This might facilitate the answers to questions that are asked and answered most and often without risking the delicate sensibilities of those newly found or soon to be lost.
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Post by LH2 »

Apology accepted Dave.

I was probably getting ahead of myself and placing too much importance on equipment choice when, like you pointed out, I've not yet shot a match.

However, I don't know how I'm supposed to "try out" rifles at matches. I don't figure I can just pick up other folks' rifles and help myself.

My current .22 is a Remington 597 semiauto. Should I put a good scope on it (to transfer later to the bolt rifle of my choosing) and try the game? Or will the so-so accuracy of the 597 likely frustrate me and turn me off of the sport altogether?

I want to ask what you guys think of the Savage Mark II-BV? The Accutrigger is supposed to be quite good, adjustable down to 2 lbs, and Savage rifles have a reputation for accuracy.

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Post by nomad »

While it's difficult to tell someone about attitudes in other parts of the country, I can GUARANTEE that a newbie showing up at a Texas match and getting acquainted would be offered equipment to try.
(At one of our recent matches, Charlie McClure not only brought the equipment for a newbie, he provided the coaching and the ammunition! At our club, prospective newbies are usually told: "Let us know when you can come out to a match and we'll make sure that there's an extra rifle and someone who'll work with you.")

There can always be a personality conflict but Silhouette people are generally ready to welcome new shooters and almost invariably try to help them get started on the right road.

If you're going back down to the level of the Savage, I'd suggest the CZ. Meanwhile, bring the semi and give it a try. No one will care how many targets you hit -- as long as you have fun. Without getting in the way of people competing, ASK for information and advice. I'd bet that you'll be made welcome. (If you're not, come over to Texas!) lol
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Post by ajj »

It's difficult to believe that ANY mechanically sound rifle tested with several brands/lots of decent ammo has ample accuracy for the beginning shooter. But it's true. The challenge of shooting offhand vastly outweighs the rifle's accuracy in the hit count. That said, we obviously want the best accuracy available. But the more important factors are hold, fit and trigger. If it doesn't "feel right" while you operate it, the best accuracy in the world won't help.
Trying a (new) friend's bolt gun is best because it's the least trouble and you're almost certain to end up with a bolt anyway. (Autos have won big matches but the follow-through is a challenge with that bolt clanging around after each shot.)
There is absolutely no reason not to take your auto to several matches while you learn the ropes. Jumping in is the most important thing. I'm fond of remembering that I shot exactly zero in my first match. And look at me now! :?
Shopping for a new rifle is just fun! We all love it. Some of us, not me, are tinkerers who enjoy the fiddling around as much as the shooting. It's like the guy who watches all the Chevys at the dirt track and dreams of doing it with a Chrysler. That's fine if you're honest with yourself about what you're doing. If you want to progress in the sport with the least frustration, get the CZ and start a savings plan that will pay for an Anschutz in two years if you're still in the game.
Good luck and good shooting.
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Post by nomad »

More suggestions:

When you show up at the match, find the match director. (WAIT until he's not running around like crazy!) Make him aware that you're a first-timer and he'll probably get you organized.

BTW, as a match director I can tell you a 'secret' about this game:
There is a lot of set-up work that goes into getting most ranges ready for a match.
Along with that, there are ALWAYS plenty of people who NEVER appear until the lifting and carrying is done! (I'm frequently amazed when shooters with 'back problems' so bad that they can't lift targets onto the stands are able to come to the line, torque themselves into a solid stance and hold a 10 lb rifle up throughout the match! Of course, I'm easily amazed...) lol
A newbie who shows up early and jumps right into helping will get appreciative treatment just about anywhere!
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Post by dwl »

LH2;

Wow, I'm still standin' on the side of the road and the conversation comes back 'round again! Now it's Remi 567s and Savages. Guess I'll jump on!

It's all good advice what these guys are saying and it works too. Just go to the match and tell 'em your new. If you go early and set racks and targets people will really appreciate you. In my business that's called Due Dilligence and everyone appreciates dilligence.

People did that for me when I first showed up, "Here's a gun and some ammo. Have a good time!" Roger Sebesta from Wyoming put up with me as an inexperienced spotter at my first regional match and never complained one word when I couldn't tell him where the shot had gone. I learned a lot just watching Roger shoot.

Since then I've returned my share of help. We had a Marine recruiter show up to a match last Spring. He told us he really couldn't afford to buy a 22 at the time and he'd be transfered in December. He didn't know if he'd ever be able to shoot silhouette again. I brought him a gun to shoot every match and the other shooters coached him. Why? He wanted to shoot (and he was polite and well behaved). We all enjoyed having some one who wanted to shoot. Hell, we'd have given him the ammo but he insisted on paying for that! Mike's gone now but where ever he went to he'll find a way to shoot.

Don't buy anything until you've shot a bunch of different guns. If you can borrow guns for a few matches that's really far and away the best thing you can do. I've got a beginner who insists on shooting his Mossberg TFH (Trigger From Hell). Well, ok. We do some cleaning, lubing a bit of judicious tuning and lots of coaching on position, mental control and he's making more progress than shooters with better guns.

As for the Remington 597, I wouldn't based on prior experience. A friend had a 597 that his wife liked to shoot and it shot fairly well, at first. Over time the scope zeros kept changing. Seems the reciever on the 597 is rather thin aluminum. Over time it deformed and every attempt to retightend the scope mounts made it worse. I've read other reports that after extended usage the bolt begins behaving erratically. You'd have to verify that youself.

The CZ is a good gun but it needs a trigger job. A few bucks for an Eric Brooks shim/spring kit or $45 for a trigger job. Neither are unreasonable costs. The gun is durable and the barrels tight. Mines been a good shooter but I just couldn't resist buying another gun.

However before you spend any money you have to consider a scope. Guys you got to start telling him about a scope.

dwl

By the way
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Post by LH2 »

Good advice about showing up early to help set up. I have no problem with that and it makes sense.

Still no love for the Savage eh? Is it because it's not a popular rifle for the game the way the CZ's are? I guess I like to be different, sometimes for the sake of being different. :P Hence my interest in the Rem 504 or Savage instead of the CZ that seems so popular. And guys on other forums say the Savage Accutrigger is great.

BTW, I did spend quite a bit of time talking to the guy running the match I attended on Saturday. He was very friendly and enthusiastic about me getting started in the game. He showed me the action of his recently purchased CZ 452 with Brooks kit (the stock broke).

I appreciate the helpful posts from everybody! :)
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2 cents about the Savage.

Post by Jetmugg »

A shooting buddy (and co-worker) of mine has one of the Savage 22's with the Sythetic stock. I'm not sure of the exact model, but it's a Mark II something-or-other. He and I both shot in our first matches on the same day. I'm not a Savage basher, or anything like that, but I must say that his rifle feels like a toy when compared to a CZ. The bolt is sloppy in the action, he has had many failures to extract with various brands of ammo, and the trigger is certainly nothing to brag about. (I'm not sure if it's the Accutrigger or not).

I had an older Marlin 22 bolt action (model 952?) that was much nicer than this Savage, and was quite accurate. My 2 cents would be to look past the Savage unless you just have to have one.

My 2 cents.

SteveM.
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CZ stuff

Post by LH2 »

dwl wrote: The CZ is a good gun but it needs a trigger job. A few bucks for an Eric Brooks shim/spring kit or $45 for a trigger job. Neither are unreasonable costs. The gun is durable and the barrels tight. Mines been a good shooter but I just couldn't resist buying another gun.
Can any gunsmith accomplish a trigger just as nice as the DIY Brooks kit, or even better? Are some gunsmiths more familiar with CZ's or rimfire silo rifles or is it an easy job for pretty much any 'smith?

Does anybody prefer the synthetic stock of the CZ Style/Silhouette model? Looks like the comb is more in line with the barrel and the pistol grip more vertical, a good shape for offhand shooting. But it's also a lighter rifle than the American or Varmint.

Do most shooters prefer the heft of the wood-stocked CZ's? I can't really decide which to start with.
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Post by nomad »

There's some dated but helpful info about CZs here:
http://projects.chatrifleclub.org/cz452mods.html

If you like the plastic stock, a pound or two of #8 shot and some 5 minute epoxy will fix any lack-of-weight problem that you're likely to encounter. It's also pretty effective for changing balance points. It works just as well for wood stocks but you have to open them up to receive the lead.
(Since it's internal to the stock, you can always mill, drill or chisel it back out if you don't like what you get and you don't harm the aesthetics of the stock!)
E Kuney
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Post by LH2 »

nomad wrote: If you like the plastic stock, a pound or two of #8 shot and some 5 minute epoxy will fix any lack-of-weight problem that you're likely to encounter. It's also pretty effective for changing balance points.
Thanks Ernie for the info & link.

Is the wood stocked American by far the more popular choice versus the plastic stocked Silhouette/Style models? Gotta admit I like the nickel finish of the Style.
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