Considering BPCR

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glen ring
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Considering BPCR

Post by glen ring »

I see our lever action guys having so much fun shooting BPCR, I think I may give it a try. I have NEVER loaded black powder and have never shot this sport. My bud has a 40-65 Winchester 1885 with Baldwin sights and I think he'll sell it to me.... What do I need to know about loading black Powder ?
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BrentD
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Re: Considering BPCR

Post by BrentD »

Glen, you won't be sorry. The BPCR game is really hard to beat. The rifle you describe sounds perfect for the job too.

There are a few things that are different about BP cartridge rifles but they are very simple to deal with.

1. you will probably want a drop tube for loading your cartridges. Something rigged up 24-30" long works quite nicely, though it can be shorter. You can make one out of scrap wood and an aluminum arrow shaft or brass tubing from a hobby or hardware store.

2. you will need a compression die because blackpowder generally compressed at least a little. If you compress with the bullet when seating, the bullet will deform slightly - enough to be hard to notice but often disastrous to accuracy.

3. you will want to use a wad in your cartridge. A 0.06" fiber or poly wad will work well and are good places to start.

3. you will need to adapt to fouling control. Many use a simple blow tube, but others prefer to wipe between shots.

I recommend that you start with powder and a bullet that is KNOWN to be excellent. In the powder department that means Swiss powder - usually 1.5 fg or 2 fg, but for certain Swiss. Others will recommend saving a dime or three with other powders that are cheap and "just as good" but spend the money early on and mess with the cheap stuff once you have the rifle running well. For a good bullet, well there are many. Buffalo Arms has several grease groove moulds that are capable of winning a national championship. If you wish to go with paper patch that is simple too. I'd be happy to point one or two out for you.

The loading of bp is simple. You start with determining seating depth - usually engraving the first band on the bullet with the rifling indicates a good depth, for grease groove bullets, then fill the case with the drop tube to whatever level lets you seat the bullet and wad w/o compressing the powder, but without any empty space as well. Dump that out and weigh it. That is your minimum load. You can then add powder a couple grains at a time and compress it to the same point as the first load to try heavier loads. Generally a very mild taper crimp or no crimp at all will be best for your cartridges. You can use any standard powder measure (I like Redding) to drop the powder, but it is generally best if you weigh each load to get a more precise amount of powder each time (not everyone does however).

Chances are, your buddy can help you learn how to do some of these things, but if not, we have plenty of people on line that can help as well. http://bpcr.net/forum/ is a safe and sane website that may prove helpful at drumming up help.

Perhaps if you let us know where you live, we can find someone nearby that can give you a hands-on tutorial.

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45bpcr
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Re: Considering BPCR

Post by 45bpcr »

Where you from Glenn?
We travel to Ridgway PA to play the game.
One thing great about the club house there is a complete loading bench, all one needs to bring are dies and shell holder and components.
There are more than a few Master Class shooters who would love to help you "hands on"

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Re: Considering BPCR

Post by BrentD »

Glenn must have gotten over the bug to shoot BPCR. :( Bummer.

Here's to hoping he gets bit once again.
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Re: Considering BPCR

Post by glen ring »

I tried shooting my bud's 40-65 Winchester yesterday at our CLA match. I have found that I'm not man enough to shoot that gun. Yes, I have turned into an old wus.
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Re: Considering BPCR

Post by BrentD »

Well, Rick Moritz has won 2 National Championships in the last two years with his .38-50...

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Re: Considering BPCR

Post by EQ Guy »

glen ring wrote:I tried shooting my bud's 40-65 Winchester yesterday at our CLA match. I have found that I'm not man enough to shoot that gun. Yes, I have turned into an old wus.
Try shooting sitting with cross sticks. This makes the recoil much more manageable. I will also second Brent on trying a 38-50. Since my shoulder and neck surgery I am much more sensitive to recoil and I have switched to shooting from sitting position.
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Re: Considering BPCR

Post by Tlee »

EQ Guy wrote:
glen ring wrote:I tried shooting my bud's 40-65 Winchester yesterday at our CLA match. I have found that I'm not man enough to shoot that gun. Yes, I have turned into an old wus.
Try shooting sitting with cross sticks. This makes the recoil much more manageable. I will also second Brent on trying a 38-50. Since my shoulder and neck surgery I am much more sensitive to recoil and I have switched to shooting from sitting position.
EQ-

I guess this means you take a zero for chickens?

5.8.1 Firing Position, Black Powder Cartridge Rifle - 200 meters - Any standing position without artificial support. The rifle will be supported by the hands and one shoulder. All parts of one hand must be forward of the pistol grip.
300, 385 and 500 meters - Any position, including crossed sticks, but excluding bench rest.

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Re: Considering BPCR

Post by BrentD »

Tim, I think it was pretty clear that EQ was referring to what we normally call "the lay down targets".

Many people take a defacto 0 for chickens. I got a nice fat zero on the last day at Nationals myself.
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Re: Considering BPCR

Post by Tlee »

BrentD wrote:Tim, I think it was pretty clear that EQ was referring to what we normally call "the lay down targets".

Many people take a defacto 0 for chickens. I got a nice fat zero on the last day at Nationals myself.
Actually, and it may only be me..... it wasn't clear to me (and why I asked the question)...

Having never shot the game, but have an interest, my apologies if this seemed like a stupid question.

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Re: Considering BPCR

Post by EQ Guy »

Tlee
Yours was not a stupid question. Brent is correct in that I shoot the chickens offhand. I can not shoot prone anymore as I have had neck surgery last year and have a titanium plate in my neck which limits what I can do but offhand is good to go. I actually rather enjoy shooting the chickens as my background is shooting highpower and smallbore silhouette which of course is all shot offhand. I started using sitting sticks after my shoulder surgery three years ago because of increased sensitivity to recoil. I am slowly becoming more tolerant to recoil as time go by. I have also been shooting 38-50 in BPCR events for at least 15 years and I have rung as many rams with my 40-65 as I have with the 38-50. I also shoot BPCR Silhouette with a 32-40 using a 9" twist and a 272 grain bulled designed by Dan Theodore. So there is hope for those of us that have problems handling recoil of the big boomers. I had a 45-90 highwall at one time but have re-barreled it to 40-72 which is another fine caliber.
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Re: Considering BPCR

Post by glen ring »

So, since I'm a weiner, is the 32-40 legal for BPCR ? I shoot a 30-30 in CLA w/o any problems and I've had a 38-55 in the past. Will the 32-20 knock down a ram at 500meters ?
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Re: Considering BPCR

Post by BrentD »

the .32-20 isn't going to knock down much of anything at 500 meters. I think I can safely say that w/o actually having done it. It won't fly the heavy bullets needed and it can't carry enough powder (which must be black of course). The .32-40 is legal but I don't think it will be reliable on rams. One person has talked about using it with special fast twist barrels, custom extra heavy bullets but I don't think he ever actually demonstrated it with a proven track record. .38-55s are pretty marginal unless fast of twist and heavily loaded with compressed 3fg. Take the .38-55 as the bottom end of reasonable.

Remember, these are 12 lb rifles. If you can handle a .38-55 in a Marlin 93, you can probably handle a .40-65 in a Brownchester .40-65 for example.
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Re: Considering BPCR

Post by glen ring »

Brent
I meant 32-40 instead of 32-20. So, do you know anyone that shoots a 32-40 in BPCR and is it a legal round ?
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Re: Considering BPCR

Post by BrentD »

I know it has been done. But I did not see it or know of it. By the rules it is a legal cartridge of the era.

Brent
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