Stock Question?

tmarshall · Post by **tmarshall** » Mon Jan 15, 2007 7:52 pm

I have a Remington LV SF in 7mm-08. I have worked up some impressive loads with hunting bullets. I know it would make weight for hunter class. But the stock is semi-beaver tail. Are stocks with semi flat forearms legal for hunter class?

ajj · Post by **ajj** » Tue Jan 16, 2007 6:44 am

Should be no problem as long as it's a "hunter style" stock in general, especially if it's from the factory. Don't have the rules in front of me but I don't believe they address hunter-rifle forend dimensions in detail. If I'm wrong, we'll know in a minute. Welcome to ye.

GeoNLR · Post by **GeoNLR** » Tue Jan 16, 2007 7:55 am

ajj wrote: If I'm wrong, we'll know in a minute.

AJJ, I love that quote...LOL. Almost like you were ducking for cover.

OK, again like AJJ said - someone will be along to corect if wrong - There are no stock dementions for hunter class. Look like a duck, quack like a duck, must be a duck. What you have there sir, is a FACTORY duck (Hunting Rifle). You are 100% legal in hunter.

Standard rifle is the class with the measurments... They can be found in the march 2005 orange book on page 6, section 3.1 (d) Stock: ~

The forend including the TG shall not exceed 2.25" wide and 2.25" deep measured from the centerline of the bore.

Magazines are exempt, but if exceed those measurments can not be used as support.

forend shall extend a min of 8" forward of the forward edge of the receiver ring.

comb shall not extend above centerline of the bore. monte carlo may rise 1/2" on off side.

the toe of the stock, including recoil pad, shall be no more than 7" below the centerline of the bore.

buttplate or recoil pad shall not extend below the lower line of the stock.

You will not have an issuie with any of those rules... here is your stock, correct?

The only thing left to do is buy a scope from me and shoot it in both classes! Haha

carl425 · Post by **carl425** » Tue Jan 16, 2007 4:12 pm

I've been wondering about this rule stuff. This rule also says "Custom made rifles are prohibited". How does one interpret that? An Anschutz 54.18 action with a Lilja barrel in a Mark Phar stock sounds pretty custom to me, but I gather that it's legal based on the discussions here.

It also says "It is the intent of the rule to describe a common hunting rifle that is built by major arms manufacturers and that is, or was, readily available to the general public over the counter."

Was the LV SF available from the factory in 7-08? If not, does that make this a "custom rifle"? Would that make it violate the "intent" stated in the rule?

You could also make the case that since the intent of the hunter class rules is to be MORE restrictive than standard rifle, the dimensional restrictions of standard may be applied to hunter as well.

These rules are very ambiguous to me. I find it very difficult to determine if I'm in compliance. And to make it worse (or better depending on your perspective) my club has no compliance tests at the matches, so I'll never know for sure until I travel away from my home club.

BTW, I'm not trying to express an opinion on the legality of the rifle in question here, the question just reminded that even with a copy of the rules, I have no idea whether it would be legal or not.

tmarshall · Post by **tmarshall** » Tue Jan 16, 2007 4:15 pm

Yeap, thats the gun. Might work up some loads with target bullets and give it a try this spring. Thanks!

Silo65 · Post by **Silo65** » Tue Jan 16, 2007 8:52 pm

Carl425

I think you will find that you have an old copy of the rules. A '96 copy I have is similar to your interpretation. Unless they have changed for 2007, GeoNLR gives a pretty accurate quote of the rules. You can order a new copy of the NRA Rifle Silhouette Rules, CS 16820, for $2.50 from:

http://materials.nrahq.org/go/products. ... =Rulebooks

tmarshall

The standard class rules may be of interest if you are interested in shooting both events, standard and hunter, with one gun. I recommend this as shooting 80 shots is not much more work than 40 and provides alot more trigger time. I shot a Rem this way for one year and the only down side was the fouling capability of the factory barrel. I rebarrelled with a Krieger and fouling is no longer an issue.

Silo65

tmarshall · Post by **tmarshall** » Tue Jan 16, 2007 9:36 pm

The LV SF in 7mm-08 was a special run for one year. They also made them in .308. Its a nice rig for deer hunting. I know it's far from the optimum rifle for silhouette, but its something I might like to play around with maybe.

ajj · Post by **ajj** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 5:59 am

Sounds like an excellent silhouette rifle to me. Perfect cartridge. Trigger is tunable. Hope you enjoy it as much as the rest of us do.

sobrbiker883 · Post by **sobrbiker883** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 5:43 pm

tmarshall wrote:Yeap, thats the gun. Might work up some loads with target bullets and give it a try this spring. Thanks!

Isn't the LV-SF a laminated stock?

tmarshall · Post by **tmarshall** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 8:23 pm

Light Varmint-Stanless Fluted. Actually its a Bell and Carlson fiberglass stock. No bedding block except right behind the recoil lug. This stock sucks! It is not very sturdy compared to an HS or Mcmillan. I had to bed the recoil lug area and get rid of the pad at the end of forearm before I could ever get decent groups. Its a shooter now, but it had me scared for awhile.

GeoNLR · Post by **GeoNLR** » Thu Jan 18, 2007 11:28 am

carl425 wrote:
These rules are very ambiguous to me. I find it very difficult to determine if I'm in compliance.

You sir hit the nail on the head! That is why the rules (the ones you were looking at) have been changed. What we have today is ....

"If it looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it MUST be a duck"

Exception - No "Ducks" with thumb holes...Ha-Ha

I was told by Greg Conner that "This year we sold more books for silhouette competition than ever. We had less contriversy than ever. Large matches such as the nationals and state matches such as WA and LA state ran smoother than ever RE: tech. The rules we have now (dated March 2005 as I said) are WORKING and I do not see them changing any time soon."

That about sums it up.... don't worry about custom, factory, borrowed or stolen. Step up to the line with a rifle that "Looks" like a hunting rifle, weighs 9 pounds or less (8.5 SB), has a 2 pound trigger, tappered barrel, and scope that's less than 1.5" above the receiver and lets have a good time. Kinda takes the fun out of circumventing the rules doesn't it? All the folk lores and urban myths about single stage triggers being "secretly" converted to 2 stage seem strange and stupid to all of us now. You want a 2 stage, fine...buy one and bolt it on. You are still going to have to hold the dot on target and break to shot. Simple as that...

Chicken

stsbuyer · Post by **stsbuyer** » Thu Jan 18, 2007 12:31 pm

Everyone,

Better take a look at this link.

Looks like if it looks like a duck it still has to fit the same jig as a standard rifle. I think everyone needs to check the hunter guns. We will need to make sure the toe does not drop more than 7" and the the comb is not to high. If it does it will not fit the NRA jig. May not be a problem at club matchs, but sure would not want to show up at nationals and find out my rifle does not fit there jig. If that was the case it would not be legal for either class.

Here we go again, Paul

http://www.nrahq.org/compete/rules/rul_ ... fle_07.pdf

GeoNLR · Post by **GeoNLR** » Thu Jan 18, 2007 1:31 pm

stsbuyer wrote:Everyone,

Better take a look at this link.

Looks like if it looks like a duck it still has to fit the same jig as a standard rifle. I think everyone needs to check the hunter guns. We will need to make sure the toe does not drop more than 7" and the the comb is not to high. If it does it will not fit the NRA jig. May not be a problem at club matchs, but sure would not want to show up at nationals and find out my rifle does not fit there jig. If that was the case it would not be legal for either class.

Here we go again, Paul

http://www.nrahq.org/compete/rules/rul_ ... fle_07.pdf

Paul,

I personally do not feel this is anything new. This would ONLY affect those persons that were shooting DIFFERENT rifles in hunting than standard WHERE their hunting rifle did not meet the jig. How many was that? Very few as I understand it. As I understand it, this applies to extremly tall folks who's LOP is way out there. This is up to the smith (Pharr, Pearson, Evelio, etc.) and they have been building to this spec anyway. Never heard of a factory rifle not meeting the jig. Another story is the person running the "jig" Pharr told a story about the guy running the jig at the nats last year (?) failed a hunter for standard and he went back in with the guy and fit it in the jig.. The elongated butt pad can be an issuie, but not one to fear, i.e. no real change that I'm aware of....

Chicken