Squadding and Relay Position

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glen ring
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Squadding and Relay Position

Post by glen ring »

I have heard shooters complain that if they started on Chickens one day, they should start on another animal the next because " that's the only fair way to do it" I've been told.

I have heard that all master shooters should be placed on the same relay and on the same animal if possible.

Our range doesn't have that many shooting positions and the only times we try to jockey folks around is when someone comes to us complaining of shooting nest to someone they don't like.

Your thoughts .
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Re: Squadding and Relay Position

Post by Snake »

I assign positions to make my life easier, such as ease of tracking shooters, systematizing scoring collection, regulating target resets and besides a 'Le Mons' start isn't practical. And I usually have competitors start on the target they ended the earlier match on (saves of sight resetting) and helps move things along. All the while I try to keep folks with their favorite spotter
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Re: Squadding and Relay Position

Post by 44 mag »

This is how I try to do it. Anyone who we feel has a legitimate chance of winning the match or the Agg will be on relay 1 and 2. They will be on a different animal because of our range size. This makes scoring easier because you can have the top shooters scores figured by the time the other relays are finished and begin to work on any shoot offs. I also have it so you will start on a different animal each day as I feel this is a fair way to do it for every shooter. Gregg Conner always told me if he felt you could win the Nationals you will be starting on Turkeys or Rams the first day. Hope this helps. Mike Haynes
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Re: Squadding and Relay Position

Post by atomicbrh »

Nothing can rattle or get in the head of the top 5% of the competitors in our sport. Not start position. Not ambient noises. Not equipment problems. Not weather conditions. The very best do not care about where or when they start as long as their normal spotter can spot for them. Nothing bothers the best.
glen ring
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Re: Squadding and Relay Position

Post by glen ring »

I think the starting of master shooters on the same relay MAY have some merit. They certainly will have the same conditions, good or bad.

The fairness question of starting on a different animal has me a bit puzzled.

Jeanne tries to please everyone she can with the squadding, but sometimes asking to be started on a different animal makes for long and hasty walks on our range.

The one thing that we've done that makes the vast majority of shooters happy is NO SMOKING on the range.
We have been amazed at the number of shooters that thank us before, during and after the matches.

Atomicbrh
Some target shooters get rattled when they are messed with prior to the match. I was joking around with one of the best ever a few years ago at dinner. I really like the guy. I was just having fun telling him how I was going to kick his ass the next day. I shot my normal AAA score, he folded. I felt bad because I really do like the guy and I like watching him shoot. He just had never hung out around with guys/gals that challenge each other like our group does.
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Re: Squadding and Relay Position

Post by OldRanger »

We move up one relay and one animal each match for starting positions. So if you were first relay on chickens you would go to second relay pigs, then third relay turkeys etc. We don't put the master shooters in the same relay or anything, they are all mixed in.

As for rattling the best, I saw Kathy shoot and win at the CBC with a rifle that had the stock cracked right at the 'wrist' during shipping. I'm sure some things can rattle them, but not nearly as easy as most folks.
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Re: Squadding and Relay Position

Post by JohninNH »

postby 44 mag » Mon Feb 13, 2017 8:06 am
This is how I try to do it. Anyone who we feel has a legitimate chance of winning the match or the Agg will be on relay 1 and 2.[quote

Geez, that's why I am always on the 9th relay.
Actually, I like it as it allows me to sit and watch and hopefully learn from the masters.
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Re: Squadding and Relay Position

Post by glen ring »

I agree that relay and animal assigned has little effect on most shooters. We try to keep the whine to a minimum.

Mike, How do you decide who is likely to win and is that just the match, or do you try to decide who will win AAA, AA etc. and try to place them according to your predictions ?
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Re: Squadding and Relay Position

Post by Another Dang 9 »

When I shoot I let the match director pick my spot. No matter where I'm put I shoot. If it gives someone an imaginary edge so much the better for them. Where would we be without adversity I say.
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Re: Squadding and Relay Position

Post by jimkidwell »

Glen,

What I have done in the past is always squad Master's, AAA's, etc..shoulder-to-shoulder on the same relay. The following match will move up two banks. ( Bird to Bird: Animal to animal): relays move up one position. You can not move people around because they don't want to shoot next to someone. There can be no negotiations. This is a National competition and not a monthly fun match........FWIW.....
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Re: Squadding and Relay Position

Post by glen ring »

I love the way things are ran at the Nationals and at the Austin rifle club. Our range only has one bank of 10 animals each but we have air reset so we have a little wiggle room at our regional. We are pretty easy to get along with on squadding. It's always interesting to see how other clubs do their matches and see if they have any new , to us, ideas to make the matches run smoother.

I wish we had the small bore/PC set up that Tim and Judy lee use at the Austin rifle club.
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Re: Squadding and Relay Position

Post by Jason »

For monthly matches, I try to put the classes on the same relay remotely close to the same animal to start. I then try to squad new shooters on the same firing point as the experienced shooters but a relay or two later. This lets the new shooters learn how the match works from the experienced shooter and then have the experienced shooter spot for the new shooter, and answer questions/coach if needed. If we have more new shooters than experienced shooters, I tend to not shoot and just help out the new shooters while I call the match. I also try not to have the master class shooters and the brand new shooters on the same relay and adjacent animals. It's disheartening to a new shooter to get excited about hitting a smallbore turkey and then see the master class shooter beside them take 9 or 10 turkeys. This is subject to squadding friends/couples/buddies on subsequent relays on the same firing point, of course.

For bigger matches, I would ideally like for shooters of the same class to start on the same animal on subsequent relays. With matches with all of the master shooters on the same relay, I've seen a few big matches get influenced by the luck of whoever happens to be on turkeys and/or rams when conditions went crazy, while the other master class shooters were quietly mowing down chickens and pigs. There's a lot less risk of differing conditions within a couple relays than there is from 10 relays (two positions times five relays) later. The squadding in that case would still need to accommodate those who are sharing gear/spotting, so wouldn't really be possible to be perfectly even but would be closer.

With that said, now that I'm in master class I've pretty well given up on winning my class on a regular basis at bigger matches. I've accepted that I don't have the focus and drive to achieve and maintain the level of skill that some of the shooters have. I think I've been in about 30 matches at the bigger tournaments and I've only been winner or tied for winner of individuals matches twice in all of that time (see luck of targets mentioned above), and never winner or tied for winner of the tournament. I'm happy to get squadded with friends that I only get to see a few times a year at most, and if my name is anywhere close to the upper end of my class at the end that's an added bonus.
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Re: Squadding and Relay Position

Post by 44 mag »

Glenn, Its just for the match winner. It dosent matter what class they are in as you know as well as I do some AAA shooters can win the whole thing. And to answer your other question. You have a pretty good idea once you recive your entries who is going to be towards the top there may be 10-12 maybe more maybe less who really have a chance of winning the whole thing. That's just how I figure it out. Makes it easy for score keeping and shoot offs. Mike
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