costs on approved matches

General BS, Match Results, Upcoming Events and all around Gossip...
Jerry G
Uber Master Poster
Uber Master Poster
Posts: 2746
Joined: Wed Apr 12, 2006 2:34 pm
Location: Casa Grande, AZ

Re: costs on approved matches

Post by Jerry G »

Does anyone know what is going on? I don't think so.
hermit5
AA Poster
AA Poster
Posts: 449
Joined: Fri Apr 27, 2012 5:21 pm
Location: NW Pa.

Re: costs on approved matches

Post by hermit5 »

Nobody will know anything until the Mystery Panel decides what’s best for us competitors.
Save all your suggestions and complaints till after the meeting,and the Silhouette committee is told how things are going to be.
Then they will have another year to implement those items at next years meeting.
As Deep Throat said in Watergate “Follow the Money”
Del
B Poster
B Poster
Posts: 13
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2016 2:39 pm

Re: costs on approved matches

Post by Del »

cedestech wrote: Wed Nov 06, 2019 5:58 am
Still not understanding... are you "registering" one match date/event (One off match, regional, state) or are you trying to register a reoccurring monthly match?
I "registered" my match 9 months or so ago as a registered 4 day match, starting on the 19th of Sept and ending on the 22nd of Sept. It is for the NW Regional BPCR Championship but I register it only as a "Registered" match rather than a "Regional" because the difference is they give you awards for a regional match, which always in my experience show up after the match and I have several years of awards sitting in a box with nothing to do with them so I just "Register" my match and save three bucks per shooter.

The issue that I always had was what the NRA defined as a "match". When I do my match, I have daily overall awards for both scope and iron as well as I have overall and by class aggregate awards for scope and for iron for the regional championship and I also have one "Ironman" award for a four day aggregate. But if the NRA considers each daily match as a match in and of it's own, then when I pay the fees, they may required me to pay for four individual registered matches. I have never paid for single day matches in the past, only paying as an overall event and registering it as a three or four day event. I've always wondered if I was doing it correctly but that is how I have done it. We have had a few national records shot at our match and the NRA has processed these records in a timely and accurate fashion and they have never questioned me on how I paid. It's just with the new requirements for tracking scores that I was questioning whether the NRA will tell me that I have to pay for each days match separately due to having individual daily match reports rather than a four day "event".

So, from the definition I copied and pasted from their online rulebook, I would surmise that my match is considered a four day "event" with four days of "subsidiary" matches. So I think that I will send in four match reports and payment for one "tournament".

But this conversation does bring up the importance of registering matches as national records are only allowed to be recorded in a "Registered" or higher match and if someone shoots a national record in your match and it's either "approved" or nothing, you get to tell them "Nice Job, but it's really not a national record because I didn't go to the effort!". Kind of sobering fact but that's the way it is...
cedestech
Distinguished Master Poster w/Palms
Distinguished Master Poster w/Palms
Posts: 2324
Joined: Sun May 08, 2011 3:06 pm

Re: costs on approved matches

Post by cedestech »

Del wrote: Wed Nov 06, 2019 11:29 am
cedestech wrote: Wed Nov 06, 2019 5:58 am
Still not understanding... are you "registering" one match date/event (One off match, regional, state) or are you trying to register a reoccurring monthly match?
I "registered" my match 9 months or so ago as a registered 4 day match, starting on the 19th of Sept and ending on the 22nd of Sept. It is for the NW Regional BPCR Championship but I register it only as a "Registered" match rather than a "Regional" because the difference is they give you awards for a regional match, which always in my experience show up after the match and I have several years of awards sitting in a box with nothing to do with them so I just "Register" my match and save three bucks per shooter.

The issue that I always had was what the NRA defined as a "match". When I do my match, I have daily overall awards for both scope and iron as well as I have overall and by class aggregate awards for scope and for iron for the regional championship and I also have one "Ironman" award for a four day aggregate. But if the NRA considers each daily match as a match in and of it's own, then when I pay the fees, they may required me to pay for four individual registered matches. I have never paid for single day matches in the past, only paying as an overall event and registering it as a three or four day event. I've always wondered if I was doing it correctly but that is how I have done it. We have had a few national records shot at our match and the NRA has processed these records in a timely and accurate fashion and they have never questioned me on how I paid. It's just with the new requirements for tracking scores that I was questioning whether the NRA will tell me that I have to pay for each days match separately due to having individual daily match reports rather than a four day "event".

So, from the definition I copied and pasted from their online rulebook, I would surmise that my match is considered a four day "event" with four days of "subsidiary" matches. So I think that I will send in four match reports and payment for one "tournament".


But this conversation does bring up the importance of registering matches as national records are only allowed to be recorded in a "Registered" or higher match and if someone shoots a national record in your match and it's either "approved" or nothing, you get to tell them "Nice Job, but it's really not a national record because I didn't go to the effort!". Kind of sobering fact but that's the way it is...

I get it now. I have held 2 - 120 shot matches in the last 2 years. Several people asked me to set it up as separate matches with the 120 as the over all match but it just seemed too complicated AND I couldn't find out exactly how to do it.... So we shot them and scored them as only 120 shot matches even though they were broken down into 3 - 40 shot segments.

I "registered" them only also. I knew with the people shooting if the weather was reasonable we'd have new records set and wanted them to count. The extra hassle with state organizations if labeled "regional" didn't seem worth it.

:)
Emmett Dibble, Houston, Texas. Where's my buddy Jason? Keeper of electronic records and banisher of little pieces of paper?
atomicbrh
Master Poster
Master Poster
Posts: 1293
Joined: Sat Apr 15, 2006 7:24 pm
Location: Rural Mississippi

Re: costs on approved matches

Post by atomicbrh »

Some members here might be interested in the July 19, 2019 ammoland article. DO NOT blame me if you do not like what the article says.
I did not write it. I only put the link here. There are many undisputed facts in that article that are not just the author's opinion.
https://www.ammoland.com/2019/07/shit-s ... z64bBwEKc5
User avatar
Hotrodrockets
A Poster
A Poster
Posts: 186
Joined: Fri Jul 12, 2013 5:25 am
Location: In a pasture with a donkey.
Contact:

Re: costs on approved matches

Post by Hotrodrockets »

A bit of stream of consciousness...

Point 1: As a match director sort of guy. I have been sending hard copy of scores to NRA Comp dept. this year.
They still don't get scores updated or when they have it is often incorrect. Then follow up letters to get things corrected.

I have asked all the good folks who compete at Tennessee Sports Foundation to keep a paper copy of their scores. Just photo copies of old book pages work fine... nothing fancy.
I need to be able to keep track. Plus I have new -to Silhouette-shooters that I do not want getting discouraged because they are earning their Class Upgrades and not getting recognized for it.


I know I can not trust the current Card system as I have guys I know are AAA who have received cards that they are “A” or “AA” for that discipline. They are honest, they tell me before the match starts that their cards are wrong. They play nice.

Point 2: Buckle up.
Now I'm going to post a topic for thought processes...... You know that topic that everyone fears to mention....

Perhaps, possibly there needs to be an overhaul or a change in how matches are “sanctioned”.

Please don't start a Sh*% show. Not Bashing NRA.

They just plain are dropping the ball with Silhouette Sanctioning . Witch is basically just keeping track of scores and updating the rule books.
Also somehow planning National Championships but I will admit I know NOTHING of that process or how NRA is involved.

Very little promotion (if any).

There must be a better way.

MY personal opinion: NRA is a 2A rights lobbying group and they have their hands full with that fight.
Plus they have their own internal crap fest they need to work out.

So constructive thoughts on how to improve this situation OR is there another way?

I will pay my NRA membership dues as I always do. Not sure I would ask guests to our range to pay any extra fees for a monthly match. Not with the current system.
Tennessee Sports Foundation President / Metallic Silhouette Society
Jerry G
Uber Master Poster
Uber Master Poster
Posts: 2746
Joined: Wed Apr 12, 2006 2:34 pm
Location: Casa Grande, AZ

Re: costs on approved matches

Post by Jerry G »

Ain't change great when things are NOT broken?
cedestech
Distinguished Master Poster w/Palms
Distinguished Master Poster w/Palms
Posts: 2324
Joined: Sun May 08, 2011 3:06 pm

Re: costs on approved matches

Post by cedestech »

Jerry G wrote: Thu Nov 07, 2019 9:32 am Ain't change great when things are NOT broken?

You mean like getting rid of the books that where clunky but worked well....

Yes, change for the sake of change is awesome....

:ymapplause:
Emmett Dibble, Houston, Texas. Where's my buddy Jason? Keeper of electronic records and banisher of little pieces of paper?
jbmarshtx
A Poster
A Poster
Posts: 182
Joined: Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:13 am

Re: costs on approved matches

Post by jbmarshtx »

I think that it was in Tulsa that Jeannie or Stan mentioned that the main silhouette person for NRA had moved on. I can't remember her name, but she was in Raton in 2018 for smallbore and maybe highpower nationals and in Ridgway this year for smallbore.

I believe that she was the one mainly responsible for scores, etc. For now, I think that the scores go to the tournrpts (or whatever email). I have no idea of the timeline for receiving updated cards. I helped Mark Pharr submit the TX State Highpower Scores, but haven't check to see if they've been updated.

A self reporting feature would be nice, but it's probably a bit too much to ask!
User avatar
jbolt
A Poster
A Poster
Posts: 213
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 8:07 pm
Location: NorCal

Re: costs on approved matches

Post by jbolt »

Per Mr. Farmer they are working on the match reporting software to be ready for 2020. Apparently the web interaction is a little different for Silhouette than other competitions.

He also indicated they were looking to set a one-time per year competitor fee of $15, similar to the book cost. I got the impression it would be handled through the online portal but he couldn't provide specifics until the software was completed.
atomicbrh
Master Poster
Master Poster
Posts: 1293
Joined: Sat Apr 15, 2006 7:24 pm
Location: Rural Mississippi

Re: costs on approved matches

Post by atomicbrh »

It is practically the middle of November. 2020 is not that far away.
Post Reply