new silhouette classifications
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Re: new silhouette classifications
Three letters IRS. The IRS regs as our accounts tells us, membership has to mean something if you club is s non-profit. Lots and lots of complexity and everyone has an opinion but the IRS does require reporting of "income" fees of member vs. non-member and depending on the balance you can get into trouble with your IRS standings. Almost all clubs in Texas (Houston) differentiate club member fees from guest fees. Guests pay more.cslcAl wrote:What difference does it make if a shooter belongs to the club or not at a NRA HP match for assessing fees?
Plus in my mind the membership of the club built and maintains the range. So I do not see any reason to not charge more for their impact to the range, targets, lead harvests, mowing, etc.
Greg
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Re: new silhouette classifications
It's getting too complicated without answers from the top.
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Re: new silhouette classifications
I get that , but you still owe the NRA $4.50 for each HP shooter club member or not, correct?
Team Sierra Member
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Re: new silhouette classifications
I just realized I will have the following classification cards:
1) Smallbore Hunter Rifle
2) Smallbore Standard Rifle
3) Highpower Hunting Rifle
4) Highpower Standard Rifle
5) Smallbore Cowboy rifle
6) Pistol cartridge rifle
7) Cowboy rifle
Target airgun
9) Sport airgun
10) Open airgun
Gosh guess I had better get a larger range bag or wallet.
1) Smallbore Hunter Rifle
2) Smallbore Standard Rifle
3) Highpower Hunting Rifle
4) Highpower Standard Rifle
5) Smallbore Cowboy rifle
6) Pistol cartridge rifle
7) Cowboy rifle
Target airgun
9) Sport airgun
10) Open airgun
Gosh guess I had better get a larger range bag or wallet.
- cslcAl
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Re: new silhouette classifications
GregG. Punch a hole in the cards and put them on a D ring. You can hang them on your shooting vest.
Al Foust
Al Foust
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Re: new silhouette classifications
For XTC Highpower the NRA gets $4.50 per shooter for Approved matches (monthly) and $5.50 for Registered matches (State & Regionals). The fee has been in effect since I started running matches in 1999.
Several reports have to be sent to the NRA after each match, a match registration fee report with the per shooter remittance, a copy of the match bulletin and a report listing each competitor's name, address, NRA number (if they have one), total rounds shot and score. They keep a running average of the last 240 shots and when that average hits a higher class they send out a new classification card with a date as to when it goes into effect. Smallbore prone is the same except the round count is generally 400 shots to get a higher classification. Oh yeah, there is no such thing as online reporting of any of this.
I enjoy running Silhouette matches because of not having to partake in a bunch of paperwork, I get enough of that at work. It will be interesting for sure to see how this pans out.
James Odom
Several reports have to be sent to the NRA after each match, a match registration fee report with the per shooter remittance, a copy of the match bulletin and a report listing each competitor's name, address, NRA number (if they have one), total rounds shot and score. They keep a running average of the last 240 shots and when that average hits a higher class they send out a new classification card with a date as to when it goes into effect. Smallbore prone is the same except the round count is generally 400 shots to get a higher classification. Oh yeah, there is no such thing as online reporting of any of this.
I enjoy running Silhouette matches because of not having to partake in a bunch of paperwork, I get enough of that at work. It will be interesting for sure to see how this pans out.
James Odom
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Re: new silhouette classifications
Are people talking about $4.50 additional per match? We shoot one standard and one hunter per month (same day). I think most people do it this way. Would that be $4.50 extra for each? We only charge $5 for each match as it is. $10 per match will drive people away, I think.
If this really happened, I could imagine a lot of non-registered matches going on everywhere. That also means a lot of unintentional sandbagging come State and Regional matches as no one would have moved up.
I can’t imagine it working like that.
Joe
If this really happened, I could imagine a lot of non-registered matches going on everywhere. That also means a lot of unintentional sandbagging come State and Regional matches as no one would have moved up.
I can’t imagine it working like that.
Joe
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Re: new silhouette classifications
Joe,
Here is the catch 22 in my mind. As I recall it is 4.50 per match (not the number of guns). I will assume this will be run the same as a regional, shoot two guns, three guns it is just a single fee per shooter. But we are operating on a rumour from good source which says they are going to do this. We have yet to see this in writing.
The conspiracy theory why? If it is just to make it easier and more consistent then maybe. If it is to see how many shooter there really are, us abandoning the sport or not registering our match could already give more data to the NRA theory that Silhouette is dying.
So I for one will wait until, I see the complete thing in writing and then react. If everyone says NO, then I believe the NRA will have to blink. I am not saying NO right now but am concerned.
Greg
Here is the catch 22 in my mind. As I recall it is 4.50 per match (not the number of guns). I will assume this will be run the same as a regional, shoot two guns, three guns it is just a single fee per shooter. But we are operating on a rumour from good source which says they are going to do this. We have yet to see this in writing.
The conspiracy theory why? If it is just to make it easier and more consistent then maybe. If it is to see how many shooter there really are, us abandoning the sport or not registering our match could already give more data to the NRA theory that Silhouette is dying.
So I for one will wait until, I see the complete thing in writing and then react. If everyone says NO, then I believe the NRA will have to blink. I am not saying NO right now but am concerned.
Greg
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Re: new silhouette classifications
cslcAl on Tue Apr 07, 2015 9:21 am
GregG. Punch a hole in the cards and put them on a D ring. You can hang them on your shooting vest.
That's funny Al.
GregG. Punch a hole in the cards and put them on a D ring. You can hang them on your shooting vest.
That's funny Al.
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Re: new silhouette classifications
I think Dennis should have waited until he had all this worked out before making the statement he made. He has created a mess for himself and it will be a long while before we hear any details from him, I think. Glenda Graves
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Re: new silhouette classifications
You forgotGregG wrote:I just realized I will have the following classification cards:
1) Smallbore Hunter Rifle
2) Smallbore Standard Rifle
3) Highpower Hunting Rifle
4) Highpower Standard Rifle
5) Smallbore Cowboy rifle
6) Pistol cartridge rifle
7) Cowboy rifle
Target airgun
9) Sport airgun
10) Open airgun
Gosh guess I had better get a larger range bag or wallet.
1. FTR longrange
2. FTR mid-range
3. F-open long range
4. F-open mid-range
5. Service rifle
6. Hipower XTC
7. Garand
8. Indoor open air rifle
9. indoor target air rifle
10. indoor sporter air rifle
11. - all your pistol classifications.
You're gonna need more than a d-ring
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Re: new silhouette classifications
Gregg We already have a place to report number of shooters on the report for approved silhouette matches. It took NRA a long time to get around to dividing the hunting classes separate from the standard. Who know what the use the reports for; as several have reported sending and the receiving a 'didn't file report' from NRA. Likewise I have rec'd the didnt file however the check for the booklets always got thru. Yes, it will be interesting to see how this pans out. IF only a change to the class titles as used in other sports causing a computer problem---- I've met several silhouette shooters that could modify the existing NRA system to change over to M-AAA-AA etc. How many can remember starting with the 50 cent card? The question raised---where is/was the silhouette committee in all this?? best wishes
Close only counts with grenades and horseshoes.
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Re: new silhouette classifications
Roger, I talked to a committee member on Sunday, and he had not heard of this till I called him. This decision has been made above their level.
Al Foust
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Re: new silhouette classifications
Well I guess I need to add my 2 cents. My concerns are how they are going to keep up with the paper work. I sent my match stuff in and a book order and received it after I already had 2 matches done. I sent it off about a month and a 1/2 before my first match. The other thing, is Greg going to believe what the computer say's people classifications are. He doesn't trust it at the Nationals. I am sure they will have to create a new position for this, which will cost them more money. Which will trickle down to us. Then there is the sandbagging factor. How are we as match directors going to know if a competitors card is current. So if we have to pay per competitor for our monthly matches, then match scores should be good for national records. I have never figured out why we have to pay for Registered matches, they don't do nothing for it other than do paperwork if someone shoots a record. Either way doesn't really matter to me, but theirs probably nothing we can do about anyway. I try to go with, if its not broken no need to fix it. Or no need to reinvent the wheel, its still round and rolls good enough. AL you are showing your age with match director sense 82. You have me by a few, not many. I also have my plane tickets for Raton. Looks like I might be shooting alone, might need someone to team up with, as long as they won't laugh out loud at me. Only a rookie that can't see very good.
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Re: new silhouette classifications
dscak1,Dan,with no word as yet from Dennis Willing,or the silhouette committee.I cannot believe that Greg Connor would say anything like the proposed cost of match registration fees.You did not name drop who this match director was therefore we cannot take that as fact.Just rumor.
Maybe he did,or did not but with out a name it may well have been.I know this guy whose brother is a janitor in the NRA building in Fairfax and he overheard a secretary talking to another secretary that the fees of something are going up.How about if that match director tells us himself what exactly Greg said.
As Joe Friday said"just the facts Ma'm."
Maybe he did,or did not but with out a name it may well have been.I know this guy whose brother is a janitor in the NRA building in Fairfax and he overheard a secretary talking to another secretary that the fees of something are going up.How about if that match director tells us himself what exactly Greg said.
As Joe Friday said"just the facts Ma'm."