Good point, Jason, although the 1710 barrels are heavier than the 1712s.

Not nearly as heavy as a 53RF taper Lilja barrel that's 25+ inches long.

Ahh, who wants to keep the stock barrel though. They usally shoot just fine but there is just something about saying " Yah its got a Lilja"

Well,

I'll throw in my opinion on this:

A good barrel is a good barrel. It could be made by Walmart for all I care. It is the smith's responsibility to properly inspect, slug, and chamber the rifle.

Things like twist uniformity should be checked, as well as proper internal taper.

I have used just about every barrel type out there on rifles, and most custom barrel manufacturers are all able to build excellent barrels.

A bad smith can ruin an excellent barrel, and then blame the poor performance on the barrel quality. I have slugged and scoped many barrels, and the mistakes I find are shocking - and still a few of them shoot well.

I have been enjoying the current Shilen barrels (the outside finish quality and precision leave a bit to be desired), and Lilja have been pretty darn good as well.

s.,

Steve B...thank you, it needed to be said. I will add that a poor bedding job/incorrect torque on the bedding screws will also act as like a bad barrel.
Mary

Let's see.
New Lija or Shilen barrel properly torqued and bedded will out shoot a stock barrel?
Every thing else being the same?
I ask because I have been shooting eley sport (chap ammo) and getting flyers.
It was pointed out that buying out expensive ammo might cure this problem but might be better value to change the barrels when considering cost of the amm vs the swap.
Does a barrel swap out require a new bedding job as well?

Thanks for the thread, insterested in the above answers.

Regards Alan

Hold on folks. If you have a bbl that doesn't shoot well, change the damn thing. If the bbl shoots a minute, live with it. I don't care who makes it.

Alan,
Yes fliers with Eley sport are common...no matter which barrel, which bedding job. Not significant enough for me to worry about when doing trigger time at a local match when compared to the cost of quality ammo.
As to your question about new barrel requiring new bedding...again many factors coming into play here. How good is the bedding now? Have you tried different lots of higher end ammo to determine what your rifle likes?
Have you scoped the bore, is there some wear or damage ( ex: from gritty bullets), is the chamber tight?
Most target rifles with ammo that the specific rifle likes will out shoot the average shooter in the standing position. How much are you willing to put out for the extra 2 to 5 points (at best) in a forty shot match? Much of the tweaking that happens with rifles is for the tinkering satisfaction of the person owning it. I think even Baby Huey got a bit of a lesson in shooting when I shot his CZ left handed (much too long of LOP for me, scope eye relief wrong for me, and I am right handed) and took two shots to take down a ram. THe trigger squueze, breath control, mental sight picture, position, experience with making the rifle fit, understanding environmental conditions, have so much more to do with hitting than is ever given creidt.

Mary

I look at a rifle as a entire suite of parts, and each one needs attention and tuning. There is alot more to building a good rifle than just sticking a big-name barrel on the end. You also have to find a smith who is willing to pull the barrel and replace if need be before it leaves the shop. When I listen to shooters argue that one barrel is better than another, it makes me grin a bit. A good barrel is just that, a good barrel.

I keep a stack of barrels here for just that reason. They have all slugged and measure out very well, and they are in different straight diameters. When I need a barrel, i just go to my rack and pull on out, versus waiting and rushing about. A good smith will do the same. Too many shooters scramble around looking for a barrel, and then are pretty much married to it when they get it due to the excessive wait for a new one or the cost of replacement.

Also, there are alot of barrels being replaced due to bad scopes. There are more bad scopes out there than bad barrels. Keep that in mind when testing.

You don't need to rebed for a barrel replacement if it still is floated, but I do a skim-coat anyhow. Cutting corners is a great way to get burned down the road. Infact, when I rebarrel, the entire rifle is rebuilt from the ground up. Even then, there are still little details that get missed.

Cant disagree with that. Makes perfect sense to me actually

Switching barrels is a risky proposition, Sometimes it needs to be done but generally it's a roll of the dice when you switch. If the barrel is bad you need to replace however few Anschutz rimfire barrels are bad. Any of the talked about names are very good but there are failures in rebarrel jobs due to the gunsmith or the barrel itself. Then there is the down time while waiting for the job to be done. I had one out on a Low Wall Winchester single shot over two years, another on a switch barrel Stevens 44 1/2 was done in 3 weeks total. Both back one is a good shooter one that was out so long is useless.

Have never seen the need to replace Anschutz barrels.

Boats

I am going to agree with BOATS and some of the other guys. Anschutz barrels are very accurate, every once in a while there may be one that won't shoot to its potential, but very seldom its the barrel, normally it is a bedding problem. I know of several shooters that have won State, and National championships with the original barrel, specially in the hunter class.
The rifle as it is stocked from the factory, is not set up for competition off-hand shooting, once the stock is replaced with one designed for off-hand competition, specially for the Silhouette game it should be as competitive as anything else on the line.
Now as far as replacing the factory barrel, the biggest reason, is to get a heavier and stiffer barrel, which will stabilize the rifle better, and it will improve accuracy somewhat.
There are several good barrel makers out there, but a lot of the bench rest shooters are really going nuts with the Shilen ratchet and octagon barrels, and also the Lilja tight bore, the Shilen barrels needs really good ammo. to perfom to the best of their potential, on the other side, the Lilja tight bore with a 53RF contour is still what I recommend to anybody wanting to replace their factory barrels for the Silhouette game, it is my experience that they will shoot great with any reasonable ammo.
Evelio.

Hawk,

Looking over the other posts, I have a few more comments that I feel are worth sharing.

1. Like others have said, factory Ans barrels are very good and more than accurate enough for the sport of Silhouette. I would argue that you'll just about never lose a match because you have a factory barrel. Just a little test for anybody here interested - Take your rifle and shoot the course from the bench from a good rest. If you can shoot a 40 twice, than anything less than a 40 when shooting from the offhand position is gonna be shooter error. It will also tell you that your rifle is accurate enought for any match.

2. If you do decide to rebarrel, do not set the bar of accuracy with Silhouette in mind. Set the bar for Benchrest accuracy. Anything less is a big waste of money. John Neihouse's rifle was built and tuned in a lead-filled fiberglass benchrest stock, laid out as a typical BR rifle. Once the action and barrel were proven for excellent accuracy, it then transitioned into a silhouette stock and became a silhouette rifle. The rifle still maintains that same level of accuracy, and that is what John asked for.

3. John's rifle happens to have a Border barrel on it, and it was selected for the excellent slugging and internal taper to the bore. It was not selected based on it's name. The way a rifle looks or what name is attached to it has zero to do with it's performance.

4. I do have a personal preference for barrels, and it's split between Shilen and Lilja. Both Dan and Ed are personal friends and I enjoy doing business with them and that's where I choose to spend my money. I feel it's important to support your friend's business, but I won't hesitate to return a barrel if it does not meet my expectations. The upside of that is I have been getting very good barrels from both shops for quite some time. Shilen barrel are not finished on the outside nearly as well as Lilja's, and sometimes they needs a little light metalwork to make a tuner / bloop tube fit just right. They can also be a pain to get a nice outside finish on. Lilja's are excellent in their OD finish. The best barrel I have ever slugged was a Shilen, and my personal rifle uses a Shilen 4R.

s.

I'm just a tinkerer, no gunsmith, but this is my personal experience,
1) Put a Shilen on my .223 prairie dog gun (kind of like BR lol), very happy with it. They had a fast turnaround as well.
2) Had a Lilja #5 put on my .260, and VERY happy with it too. 5 month wait to get it. The gunsmith showed me, he had it on the lathe with the Micro on it, he spun the barrel several times, and the needle in the gauge never moved (with marks down to a thousandth). Impressive machining if you ask me. It's a really good barrel, shoots great, but it didn't like any of the factory ammo I tried, which surprised me. But, I expect better when I get handloads dialed in.

I shoot a lot of Schuetzen every rifle is a custom. Read the post on some forums you would think only Ron Smith gain twist barrels with Miller Actions can win matches. Most post come from the area Ron shoots. Shooters that use his very good barrels and rifles Smithed by Ron himself. Other post from the East Coast tout CPA's & Douglas barrels,. CPA the builder that sets up many East Coast rifles has a shelf full of Douglas and turns out a re-barrel job in a matter of weeks. Those two names win a large share of matches.

Truth of the matter is you need equipment that’s up to standard, If your rifle is the equal of other equipment on the line it makes no difference what the name on the barrel/action/scope is. Offhand the shooter makes the difference. Top quality stuff is on winners rifles for a reason however one top name vs. another is insignificant. It is very important to have the total package work well and for the rifle to be on the line and ready for matches. Whole lot more than barrels involved and in my view a good gunsmith that will keep you shooting is key.

Silhouette I am not so serious and use factory stock 18 year old Kimber Hunter rifle with a tweaked Leopold. It won't shoot groups with Anschutz rifles. It has done well in Club matches and not holding me back. If top level was the goal it would pay to replace it, with a slightly tweaked Anschutz

Boats