boats wrote:Way I see it is Silhouette is a difficult game and it takes top equipment to compete. With no class for entry level rifles like we used to have with Hunter class the barrier to entry is just too high for the average guy.

I disagree. I made AAA class with a CZ 452 Varmint with an Eric Brooks trigger kit in it that I installed myself, and I don't think that accomplishment is all that uncommon. This is a shooter's game, not an equipment game. There are classes for entry level shooters, whether they are shooting entry level equipment or the finest gear that money can buy. The great gear helps compete at the top end of the master class, but very few shooters make it there.

In my mind there are two different things being thrown around here. At our local club to entice new people (me being 1 of them), we have quite a few options. To get new people involved we have a shoot what you brung what ever it is and have fun policy (including a varmint class that shoots off a front rest only). We tell people that if they want to compete in the NRA rules to get sanctioning points but if you just want to come and have fun with shooters and experience this fun game then bring what ever you want and have fun just don't do target damage.

When I went to my first match, had I been fed all the rules and regulations about guns and classes and what not I would have walked out and never looked back as I didn't and don't have any guns that qualify. Let people experience and enjoy and they will come. make any match open to anything that people bring and help them out and tell them that if they want to compete for prizes or class then there are rules to apply but otherwise come and have fun.

Seems like the most logical solution to me.

I agree with Jason I also made AAA with a CZ 452 Sil before springing for the Pharr 1712 and I know a couple others as well. I am nipping at Master scores now but the rifle didn't instantly put me up in higher scores. I can have a crappie day with the 1712 just as well as any other rifle.

As for dying I don't think so but if the amount of response I have gotten to the website I put together for Gulf South States silhouette matches from Match Directors would lead me to believe they already have all the shooters they can handle since I haven't heard from anyone but Pat S. Emailed all the match directors I could find in the Shooting Sports listing and have a grand total replies of ZERO. That was over 3 weeks ago.

So I am thinking I will just make the page as nice as I can for our local area matches and those that want to contribute can if they so please otherwise their match page will be as informative as that little list in the NRA magazine. Need to try and get linked up with a couple of the local shooting forums as well I think that might help attract new shooters to give it a try.

Besides that the silhouette game is not easy and many people who have money to spend on equipment want to spend it on the types of shooting they can improve in quickly and be competitive. I've seen people spend money buying equipment that would help them place higher in that particular shooting discipline. Silhouette is not that type of discipline. The high end gear will help you to compete at the highest level but it will not put you there all by itself.


Dee

in the northeast the answer to the original question is yes, a lingering death.

that being said i will be trying to keep it alive in my area by being stat officer, the last guy was chained for 7 years and has had enough, hasnt shot in years.

I made hunter SB AAA with a 10-22 shooting Eley Black box and a $100 36X Tasco scope. It ain't the expensive equipment!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It took some work on my part to get the gun to shoot 1 1/4" 5-shot groups but it did with the factory bbl.

I want to chime in here just because I can.

Can the game be shot with entry-level gear? Yes.
Can the game be shot well with entry-level gear? Yes.

Are your scores better with better equipment, ammo and a vest? Yes.

The hurdle I overcame, only by my love of shooting in general, was the frustration of fighting entry level equipment and luckily having the means and love to invest in competition equipment. This completely removed the frustration and allowed me to enjoy, and therefore, shoot better. But when I think of the years and ammo spent fighting an ill-fitting stock and crappy scopes, it's a wonder we have many, let alone young and not-so-wealthy shooters at all sometimes...

unfortunately, from what i hear here and from others, yes, and it's a terrible thing.

in contrast, our matches in factoryville Pa. hasn't had as many shooters as we do now, at least in recent memory.

so far this year we've had the highest number of shooters at 21, and the lowest at 12, averaging 14 shooters on match day.

34 different shooters in all in 2011 coming from Pa., Nj., and Ny., with only 12 of the 34 being "the usual suspects".

so far this is an increase of 4 shooters per match from last year (2010 average of 10 per match), and an increase of 13 more different shooters compared to last year (2010 21 different shooters) at the mid season (july). in august we had 17 shooters, and that was while the nationals were being held within a few hours drive at ridgeway.

i think a big part of it is promotion. the matches aren't going to run themselves, you have to go out and kiss those babies and shake those hands like a politician. especially these days where time is short and bills are not - it's tough to have folks with leisure time to dedicate to anything, especially shooting competitively. when i got hooked 3 years ago, the guy that was running the matches didn't want to do it anymore, so rather than possibly seeing the matches go away i jumped at the oppurtunity to do it. 3 years ago, we were lucky if 6 shooters showed up, but the range was in poor condition, and the matches were not sanctioned.

some of my thoughts (or at least what i think seems to be working):

1. range condition - no one is going to pay to play a golf course that is overgrown and in general disrepair. range condition should give the shooter a warm and fuzzy feeling to actually want to show up and enjoy an afternoon in a pleasant setting. a little elbow grease, some time, and some planning goes a long way.

2. low entry fees - it's tough to keep #1 going if they are too low, but again today's bills makes it harder for most everyone to come up with even a few bucks to dedicate to the competition. for new shooters to the sport, our matches are free. if they like it they will be back, if not, no big loss, they have nothing to lose. also juniors (under 16yrs) shoot for free.

3. when promoting the sport, it should be an exciting promotion - not the stagnant same ol' same ol', or come off like it is for old men with kiddie guns. promoting it as a serious, fun, and safe way to parctice for small and big game hunting seasons, 3 gun, 4p, and other shooting competition diciplines makes it more attractive.

4. as mentioned before, you don't need $2,000 worth of stuff to compete. i like to stress that grandpa's squirrel gun, a couple boxes of ammo, good use of some kentucky windage or adjustable optics can actually get you solidly on the scoring board. i just made AA in hunting rifle (whohooo!) last month with a 127.00 walmart savage, 69.00 walmart scope, and 2 boxes of blazer ammo 17.00 a brick. so alot comes down to shooting ability as we know. sure equipment plays a part in it, but i believe that ability reigns supreme in this game, equipment can't be used too much as an excuse. plus the different shooter classes in each division allows folks to compete with other folks of similiar skill and equipment.

5. encourage junior shooters - they are the future of the sport. whether they hit 2 or 20, encourage them, and their parents too.

6. no range nazis! - no one wants to go to a match when someone is preaching up and down the line. take it seriously and safely - but remember to have fun!

7. awards - in addition to the usual pins- i'm mot a big fan of the theory everyone gets a trophy, but at least have some kind of award or notariety for a match shot well to those that have acheived it. it gives everyone something to shoot for, and keep coming back. of course between #1 and #2 above, it's tough to get "decent" awards, but thinking out of the box comes up with a few ideas that are attractive to shooters. i am also going t have a club "championship" next year. the more you attend throughout the year and post decent scores, you can win something (maybe a championship hat or ammo / scorecard holder, i haven't figured it out yet).

8. is too much of a good thing a bad thing? i'd like to have more matches or practice days a month, but i can't help to think that may spoil the "specialness" of a monthly match. i can't help but think that too many oppurtunities to shoot leaves one to skip several matches - like a bus, if ya miss another will be around shortly. before you know it, you are missing more. perhaps less is more, and makes the matches more of an event not to miss?

9. get those flyers out there at the local grocery store, bulletin board at work, local gun shops (remember to give them a "plug" or two at the match). post your matches on fine sites like steelchickens, other rimfire sites or sites with rimfire sections, and other rifle competition sites. i've picked up several shooters by doing that, along with getting a link to information on the club web site if they have one.

http://www.steelchickens.com/forums/vie ... f=9&t=5158
http://fscweb.org/
http://fscweb.org/small%20bore%20silhouette.htm

you would be amazed how much google searches prompts new and seasoned shooters to find, recognize, and attend your event. i've been lucky enough to pull in shooters from Pa, NY, and NJ by doing that.

10. going to club meetings, local sportsmans dinners, etc. to be an ambassador or salesman of the sport and of the matches. i hope to have the boy scouts come next year as a possible way to earn a badge, and am pursuing some local outdoor show coverage.


luckily i'm blessed with a great bunch of guys that are not judgemental and helps out newcomers, which in turn i believe keeps them coming back and bringing others with them. even without dedicated setters, these guys also volunteer to set targets (even in the rain), set up the course, and break it down too. i actually think that make for a tighter group of guys, and the impression to newcomers that no one is "too good" to do a little work. we have no "snobs" that i can see, and everyone has a good time.

i try to do setting and breaking down myself as i believe the shooters should only have to concentrate on shooting, but they help anyhow and for that i am grateful, and truely blessed with these guys.

so is it dying? probably, but only if we let it.

with that, here's a shameless promotion for the Factoryville sportsman's club SBS matches to be held on Sept 11th., practice at 9:00, matches start at 10:00. $6.00 for 2 sanctioned matches, soda or water beverages included. new shooters to the sport and juniors shoot for free. attending the sept or october matches qualifies you to shoot the season ending money and prize match "Pirkey Challenge" see august scores for details... http://fscweb.org/august%202011%20scores.htm (i think that having to attend a previous match requirement keeps "ringers" from showing up and cleaning house on the regulars ;) ).

BTW the bridge is oout on one of the main roads, see the main FSC page for alternate routes - i even included GPS coordinates for the gizmo orientated.

Most are dying.
Trap seems to be alive and well. not to say its easy, but less work than a rifle, no work in between strings, and action.
Defensive shooting, tactical shooting seem to be on the rise. Lots of action- no bullseye aspect of scoring, just hit and done at close range.
Money- my grandkid has more in I-pods, game boys, Wee and games than I have in 2 HP rifles!

I think its about time- It takes a lot of time to get good. And action. This generation has grown up on action flicks, and life is fast moving! The You Tube generation aint enjoying setting in the pits for a 45 minute relay talking reloading.
My sons grew up around guns and hunting. Neither had any interest. My oldest tried HP for one season, but work and kids well shooting went to the back burner. Now we golf, less time, more action, cost as much.

I think it has as much to do with how society is changing and MUCH SHORTER attention spans! ACTION or Cahnge the channel. (Clicker generation, as I like to call it)
I belong to a club with the best 600 yard range in New England. HP prez lost club, HP guys lost interest in club fighting, revenues down, and now there is talk about cutting it up to make defensive shooting ranges. A shame to the HP community, but may benifit the club in the big picture.

So I dont have the answers, but looks like some of our most popular shooting shorts may be "phased out" by more high action, quick moving sports.

Just my opinion
chuck

chuck d wrote:Most are dying.
I belong to a club with the best 600 yard range in New England.
chuck

Which club are you talking about?

what a shame on cutting up the range,

i am committed to PFFG match director duties for next year, but honestly if no one from my club starts shooting i suspect it will be the last season there.


i can have more fun with less expense shooting 3d. and field archery.
dave

As a father of two junior shooters i will tell you what our issues are...other sports. Baseball and football dominate where I live here in Oklahoma. Weekends are flooded with games and time is limited. I really miss shooting silhouette with the Red Castle guys and so do my boys. We just dont have the time. Practices are nightly for the sports and the time we have off, Silhouette season is over. Its tough to juggle all the things for a couple young guys who want to shoot but also want to play with their friends in sports. I am sure if we didnt have traditional school sports it might be different.

TT...glad to see you still live! The boys are getting big I'm sure, but always look at the lighter side. Less injuries in shooting than in football.

Mary

Hi Mary!!! Yes its been a long time. I didnt even get to make a shoot this year. ITS KILLING ME! The boys are almost 11 now. They are growing so fast. I still want to get them trained up and to a regional or nationals. I think they would love it. We still shoot about once a month at the farm on a Sunday and they are getting better each year. How's your, not so little, boy doing. Its been about 3-4 years now since I saw you all.

The not so little boy is 21 now....but he is fine. You should bring the boys to Winnsboro next year, a good match for kids!
Look forward to seeing you at a match soon.

Mary