I'm just about out of SK Standard Plus, which I've been shooting for about a year now. It shoots "good" but not "great" out of my Annie 1712. What's a popular mid-priced ammo these days? I'm not looking to buy Eley EPS, but I'm also not going to shoot Remington Thunderbolts.

Is there anything in the market right now that stands out as a good value, consistent standard velocity ammo?

SteveM.

Since I bought that case of Eley Club Xtra from Cathy, I haven't needed to find anything else. It was supposedly downgraded Eley EPS or something and has the EPS bullet. I paid $600 a case plus shipping I think. I just emailed Cathy and asked what she would recommend with me having just moved into Master in both classes but not competing with the best of the best yet. She recommended that and she was right. It's shoots wonderfully. Before you spend $400+ a case on something else, hit her up at http://www.goodshootinginc.com and see if she has any Tenex that's been downgraded and packaged as something else. If not, just ask her what she would recommend at your skill level or price point. She's not going to steer you wrong and very few people know ammunition for the silhouette game like Cathy.

I still use SK Plus and Match. Got a few cases of RWS Rifle Target that shoots well also.

In all honesty, you really have to buy a few boxes of each you find in your price range (make sure they let you try ones that they have a lot of that lot number on hand) and see what your rifle likes best. Every rifle is different.

All my 1712's like Federal 711B and you can't go wrong with Eley Target Rifle.

Pardon my being a bit off topic, but isn't all Eley EPS rifle ammo (except Sport) manufactured the same and then after shooting graded into which ever accuracy specification it falls in to.

My thoughts are that the ammo Cathy was selling is nothing other than Eley ammo manufactured with the "EPS" and bullet style bullet that falls into the accuracy spec for being labeled as Club Extra. I like it so well, I bought 6 cases from Cathy and love it!

BTW, does'nt "EPS" satnd for Enhanced Priming System and came out at the time Eley started a new manufacturing quality standard? The new bullet design just come out at the same time?

Curious George

Travelor wrote:Pardon my being a bit off topic, but isn't all Eley EPS rifle ammo (except Sport) manufactured the same and then after shooting graded into which ever accuracy specification it falls in to.

Curious George

Since there is a difference in the actual bullet profile and lubricant, it's unlikely that all Eley is manufactured the same way. It is possible that the bullets are profiled and lubricated after a lot is tested but that is pretty inefficient. It's more likely that Eley is as advertised.

Eley probably manufactures each tier to the higher specification, then down grades a particular lot if it falls outside a particular range. As you work down the line, specifications loosen up, which does explain lot to lot performance variability in a given rifle. I expect Federal does the same with 719 and Automatch, since they have the same performance specifications, look the same and appear to use the same lube. Both shoot very well but one is ~$40 a brick and the other is bulk packed for ~$15.

Travelor wrote:Pardon my being a bit off topic, but isn't all Eley EPS rifle ammo (except Sport) manufactured the same and then after shooting graded into which ever accuracy specification it falls in to.

My thoughts are that the ammo Cathy was selling is nothing other than Eley ammo manufactured with the "EPS" and bullet style bullet that falls into the accuracy spec for being labeled as Club Extra. I like it so well, I bought 6 cases from Cathy and love it!

BTW, does'nt "EPS" satnd for Enhanced Priming System and came out at the time Eley started a new manufacturing quality standard? The new bullet design just come out at the same time?

Curious George

George,

Here is what I have been told from time to time... Tenex and match EPS also have very stringent cosmetic standards that have to be met. Over the years I have (as well as many others) bought Tenex 'blems' and 'mis-marked' EPS, etc. Some on here take that ammo and test it for accuracy against the other ammo lines, I have not one time heard a complaint about any of the ammo that Bart (the importer) has brought in and represented at tenex or Match ...

Let's say a ammo exceedes the accuracy standard for tenex, but the cases are not miror polished... As I understand it, they do 'mis package' it in another package and sell it off in different markets. They also have 'minimums' for case lot #'s that they can import through the 'normal' chanels, Bart also has assess to the short runs as well.

Long story short, I personally do not care what box it is in, I look at how it preforms. I have recently been shooting some of the stuff in the baby blue box labeled 'pistol' and it shoots better in every rifle I have shot it through than any Match EPS I have ever tested. I wish I had 5-6 cases.. but here is the deal, they have this ammo in the $4-$5 per box range EVERY year (well for the lst (5) that I have been buying it)

Chicken

Reminds me of a old saying "It's all good... only somes better"

Bob259 wrote:Reminds me of a old saying "It's all good... only somes better"

Yup!

I have yet too break into my case of Standard Plus, sometime next year I'll be looking for the next batch of whatever to hoard.......

Chick, you are absolutely right again. I got 5 cases of baby blue from Cathy. She explained it is Tenex downgraded 2 times ( for what reason who cares), but this stuff is way too good for silly. I only use it for prone and it groups as good as anything I've tried. Kevin

Another thing many have not mentioned here was Eley's new "Half of Half" policy... When they moved factory locations, as Bart tells it, the Eley Execs felt like they were lagging the market and tenex was not what it used to be in regards to market share. The new company directive was to take all of the mfg tolerences and cut them down by 1/2. then take THAT # and cut in in half...Example if a old # was .001 it was now .00025

MANY of us 'Humans' will never know that the 'downgraded' tenex on THAT # was say .003 ... out of spec... that is what they call 'Match' ... it is further explained how most of the Match EPS now sold exceedes the mfg standards of red box tenex of just a few short years ago....

How much of this is smoke and mirrors? Like others posted, who cares, but it brought about change in the market place... Look at Lapua's new 'Center X' offering... I personally have not tested it (Retail aproaching $1200 per case) but this stuff is supposed to be the real deal...

Anyway, I remimber some years back (2005) I was at the range and a BR guy stoped by to look at my "Toy" gun (Phar built 54 sporter).. he asked me how well it shot. I told him it would hold under 1" is the conditions were right with many groups in the .5's and .6's ... he started to tell me that wasn't SQUAT at 50 yards.. I agree... I was talking about 110 yards (Rams)... he started in telling me how that could not be done, time in time out, world records and etc. I tild him to look through the spotting scope... called the target and put 5 in a group at the ram board that could almost be covered w/ a dime (could see just the outer line of an edge under the dime..) This was with some $4.25 per box 'Mismarked' Match eps... I don't care what you call it, the stuff we are getting no adays is good...

Heck in the last cpl years folks at our club (some on this forum) have started shooting matches at 200 yards.. George T coulod give us the specs but I thought the last match I went to there were a couple in the sub 2" range for a 20 shot match .. This is a match, I am assuming the guys with rail guns have blown this stuff away... but we are talking 200 yards... 22LR ... Haha

This will be a neat journey, but I bet past 200 yards, the ride will not be cheap... LOL

(Watch me look like a Jack Arse when in 5 years there are 500 yards comps with .22LR)

Chicken

At 500yds, the weak link with a 22lr won't be the gun or ammo. It will be the shooter. I don't think there's every been a shooter that could call the wind well enough to print small groups at 500yds with a 22lr.

I have some stuff in a blue box and it has the EPS lead and lube. It isn't the polish that makes it different. 10X and Match are different than the rest of the ammo that Eley makes.

Enhanced Production System.

Travelor wrote:BTW, does'nt "EPS" satnd for Enhanced Priming System and came out at the time Eley started a new manufacturing quality standard? The new bullet design just come out at the same time?

300 yards, for a while now.
http://www.oscinc.org/Buffalo_runners.html

GeoNLR wrote:...have started shooting matches at 200 yards...