1827 Barrel Question

Hoser · Post by **Hoser** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 8:10 am

kevinp wrote:HOser, glad to see you here and look forward to shooting with you soon.

How about this Sunday? Bring your Glock.

Hoser · Post by **Hoser** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 8:13 am

So.... I cant find where the rulebook (and I have looked) states the taper must run from the breech to the muzzle for Hunter Division.

So for this gun to be legally shot in both will I have to replace the barrel?

stsbuyer · Post by **stsbuyer** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 8:37 am

Hoser wrote:So.... I cant find where the rulebook (and I have looked) states the taper must run from the breech to the muzzle for Hunter Division.

So for this gun to be legally shot in both will I have to replace the barrel?

I looked at the rule book myself and it states hunter type tapered barrel and no bull barrel. All hunter rifles I see on the line have tapers form chamber to muzzel and most any factory rifle would be the same. By no bull barrel I think the intent is that no barrel the same od from chamber to muzzel.

Paul

genphideaux · Post by **genphideaux** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 9:18 am

Hoser,

I think that if you showed up at a match with a reverse tapered barrel, which is not a common taper for a hunter gun, and tried to certify it for hunter class, not only would the certifying official not pass it, but upon your challenging his ruling, a committee meeting would confirm it is not a common hunter taper thus barring it from the hunter class for that match. The committee would pass their judgment on to the match director, who would implement it. I do know the 2007 rule book states the match director has the final word at their matches. I know for a fact the Mary, Evelio, Paul and I have all been not only certifying officials, but committee members and match directors. I think you will find that this interpretation of the taper rule is widely accepted and enforced.

Having said all of that, local matches are not as stringent as the state, regional and nationals. I know that if you showed up at my local match, I would inform you that you can shoot, but that a hunter score will not be recorded and your standard score will be. This action would curtail any other shooter from lodging a protest against your equipment in the hunter class. I then would explain the reason for my actions and help provide information on how to rectify your situation.

Were all here to have fun, but as much as we hate to, we must interject some form of controls and order to this sport to keep the playing field even. Have fun, play by the rules, win by the rules, and their will never be any doubt about your ability, honor and fairness.

jneihouse · Post by **jneihouse** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 9:48 am

Reverse taper discussion may be moot.....What does the gun weigh? More than 8.5 lbs and it's not hunter class legal. Agree with the Dawg, as a match director I would tell you the same.....No debate... This season it seems that nearly every match I run at our home range sees someone show up with some variation of a modified 10-22 to try to shoot both classes. Invariably They want to debate "degree of taper" etc.....Had one guy early this season try to convince me that the chamfer aroung the muzzel of the barrel constituted "taper" as the book did not specify where the taper had to begin......

Kitty

Innocent · Post by **Innocent** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 10:03 am

Where does the line for appointment to the Supreme Court of Silhouette Rules start?

Hoser, I agree with you that I cannot find anywhere in the rules that the taper has to be from the chamber to the muzzle. However...oh boy here comes the "legaleze" I quote from the rule changes on the NRA webpage about Hunter rifle The intent of this rule is to describe a common hunting rifle.

That being said, I concur with James and John, if I were match director and in a local match, I would allow it to be shot but not count for awards/classification purposes due to interpretation of the rules as they stand now. Gator??? Where are you on this one...on your way to Zwolle?

Mary

genphideaux · Post by **genphideaux** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 10:04 am

jneihouse wrote:Reverse taper discussion may be moot.....What does the gun weigh? More than 8.5 lbs and it's not hunter class legal. Agree with the Dawg, as a match director I would tell you the same.....No debate... This season it seems that nearly every match I run at our home range sees someone show up with some variation of a modified 10-22 to try to shoot both classes. Invariably They want to debate "degree of taper" etc.....Had one guy early this season try to convince me that the chamfer aroung the muzzel of the barrel constituted "taper" as the book did not specify where the taper had to begin......

Kitty

To me John, as a match director all debates are internal and my common answer is

kevinpagano · Post by **kevinpagano** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 3:17 pm

Hoser since I currently glockless and magless for the first time in my adult life. I cant shoot with you but I sure am wanting to shoot an idpa match is that this Sunday??

Evelio Mc Donald · Post by **Evelio Mc Donald** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 6:03 pm

Agree with Mary, Paul, and the Dawg, as a match director myself, a reverse taper barrel will never be certify to be used on the Hunter class, we have enought problems as is.
Evelio.

psteiger · Post by **psteiger** » Fri Oct 19, 2007 10:49 am

I loved my prize. 5 British Pounds, if I hold on to it long enough, it could be worth $15.....

I thought about framing it. We shot 2, 22 matches and 3 air rifle. Or, one for each gun. She even shot my Steyr for open, (the same one she shot 50/60 at the state match last month, where I didn't break the 30's) It was a merciless butt whuppin. I enjoyed every stinking second. She was completely unfazed. In reality, it wasn't so much me shooting good, as it was her not shooting as good as she normally does. C'est la vie! I'll choke later. But f she shoots well, I still wn 'cuz it's so fun to watch....

As to Fortner weight, I remember mine being 7 pounds in a CF stock, and only 9 lbs with an 18 -40 in the factory stock. Remember these guns were made to be carried duing the biatalon, so they're pretty light. Though the barrel is pretty much the same diameter, it is by no means a "bull barrel" Look at one sometime. It is lighter and thinner than most of the hunter barrels out there, but I replaced mine because it didn't taper. I hope to see more Fortners at Winni!

Innocent · Post by **Innocent** » Fri Oct 19, 2007 10:57 am

Hey Cubano,
I have some Euro's if you are going to pass out that kind of money. They are various collectable versions...traded a nickel collection (when we went throught the change the nickel every 6 months) to my Belgium biker buddy. Ended up with an additional two bottles of wine with it.

Innocent

Hoser · Post by **Hoser** » Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:30 pm

Cool. Thats exactly the info I was looking for.

Now for the dilemma... Order a new Lilja barrel for this 1827 or buy a 1712 just for hunter.

Last question.

Would a suppressor (silencer) be legal for either Hunter or Standard, or both? I legally own several and enjoy shooting with them. In fact, I wish they were mandatory sometimes.

Innocent · Post by **Innocent** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 12:42 am

In answer to your dilemma...do you know how many 22's you own? If so then you do not have enough and you should start to rectify that with the purchase of a 1712.

Mary

jneihouse · Post by **jneihouse** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 9:47 am

Would a suppressor (silencer) be legal for either Hunter or Standard, or both? I legally own several and enjoy shooting with them. In fact, I wish they were mandatory sometimes.

You're just looking to get picked on, aren't you????

Don't think silencers are specifically prohibited in the rulebook, however a barrel atttachment wouldn't make it in hunter riifle....Doggone rulebook is just not specific enough.....doesn't rule out superman capes, red clown noses or fat men shooting in thongs ether......what kind of sport is this???

Kitty

Hoser · Post by **Hoser** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 10:41 am

jneihouse wrote:You're just looking to get picked on, aren't you????

Pretty much...

I only ask because I went to a NRA 1,000 yard F-Class match and I had a can on the end of my Tubb2000. I was told I was not allowed to shoot because "Everyone knows that silencers are illegal to own and I should just be glad they were not calling the cops." I showed them my paperwork then the Match Director decided that my suppressor was illegal because