Some rules for smallbore standard rifle seem unfair

[Innocent]

Try coming out and shooting before stating that the rules are not fair. Yes there are requirements that have been put in place to prevent some stuff that occurred over twenty years ago. There are lots of guys over 6'4" shooting well into the master class....I have seen others shoot guns way too short for them, in fact I shot a local match recently with my son's old cricket, well over 3 inches too short for me, original horrible trigger and still pulled off a score of a 31.

Mary

[steve b.]

I find this discussion comical at best. If you think 3P is a more level playing field, you got a big surprise around the corner. Silhouette is about as good as it gets for keeping things even between shooters.

Go shoot a couple of matches.

I would even say take any type of .22lr you want, anything to a local match. And then watch a young teenage girl with a $400 CZ make you wish you would have picked a different relay. The magic ain't in the wand.

s.

[curmudgeon]

I want to change the rules to make the turkeys bigger.

I want to change the rules to make the turkeys dance more slowly.

[boats]

I Shoot Silhouette Hunter class. Standard out of the box Anschutz, it's the equal of any rifle on the line does not need modifications. Expensive but no better score wise than a 500 dollar CZ. Small Bore Silhouette is active across the country with lots of good competition. Don't know how many active competitors there are but must be thousands

Also shoot offhand Schuetzen. Schuetzen can be different match to match no central sanctioning body. Few rifle rules. Basically single shot that's all. My gun weighs 14 lbs high cheek piece palm rest hook butt plate. You can't buy them off the shelf, almost all custom made and very expensive. I doubt if there are 250 competitive Offhand Schuetzen shooters in the US. Biggest problem is few people to shoot against except in regional matches. Two or three locations across the country get more than a couple dozen shooters. Most states have a handfull on the line. Barrier to entry is the Rifle, hard to get one, few have them.

Had NRA Sanctioned Silhouette been allowed to develop along the unlimited Chin Gun lines it would have become just like Schuetzen. Elitist sport for very few. Equipment rule protects the sport. No doubt about it.

Boats

[bigmike6970]

I have been shooting smallbore silhouette for about 2.5 years. I am 6'6 and 280 lbs, from the tip of my trigger finger to my armpit is 32in elbow to armpit is 11 inches and 15in from armpit to top of the hip bone.

I think that if you make the rules too loose then you will have all sorts of contraptions on the line, sure it is easier for a shorter person to get the rifle to fit them better, but that does not mean by default that they are going to shoot better that you are. Why stop at the equipment to make it more fair, So since I am tall maybe the targets should be higher off the ground so that I am shooting more level like the shorter shooters do. Maybe they would let the tall people shoot from their knees,so that we are more level with the other shooters and the targets.

Where would it end in order to make it more fair?

I shoot the same rifle in both Hunter and standard. I do not think that I have felt that the rules about the rifle have held me back in anyway. I have high scope rings and I have extended the stock to fit for a better length of pull for me. I am able to get my elbow on my hip, I know a lot of that has to do with body shape and what not. but a lot of it has to do with your position. When I first started I was not able to get my elbow on my hip and be in any position to shoot at the targets. I have talked to the other shooters at my club and at the various matches I have attended to see what works for them. I watch the various positions other shooters use to see if it is something that would work for me.
As stated look at the rules to see how you can make the rifle fit you and still be within the rules look at the distance you are allowed to have the toe of the stock from the center line of the bore.

In the time that I have been shooting I have made several changes, both with the rifle and the my position some worked and I have kept them and some did not work and they were discarded.

I also bought David Tubbs book high power, and I have read though it a couple of times each time picking up new information. There is a good section in the book on building position, and it at least gives you a place to start but you will have to build a position that works for you. There is also a good section on natural point of aim.

Some of the ranges I have shot at you kind of shoot down hill, so at chickens when I am in position, only the very bottom of the butt stock is touching my shoulder, for the other animals the butt stock is in a lower position.

My problem is that the animals like to dance around in the scope
When things are working, I bring the rifle up get into position and the dot falls on the animal and it seems like it is stuck there.
when things are off (Position / Mental / or whatever), i cannot get the animals to stand still for a second in the scope. That is something that I am working on but i feel that has more to do with me that the equipment or the rules.


Plus if they change the rules to make it more fair, that just takes some excuses away that you can use as to why you did not hit as many animals as you "should" have.

bigmike

[DennisC]

"Had NRA Sanctioned Silhouette been allowed to develop along the unlimited Chin Gun lines it would have become just like Schuetzen. Elitist sport for very few. Equipment rule protects the sport. No doubt about it."

I do agree with above statement, but it would be in "perceptions only" protecting the sport. We 'believe' we must have what the leaders have to compete and that that is what;s holding us back when in reality it's really as Dustin mentioned.....practice, practice, practice, practice, then go train for few hours.
Case in point...the chin gun..quintessential epitome of off hand excellence, promoted by the Man himself. decade later a kid from down south rewrites the record books with a 'standard' rifle...go figure.

[shooterer]

I would even say take any type of .22lr you want, anything to a local match. And then watch a young teenage girl with a $400 CZ make you wish you would have picked a different relay. The magic ain't in the wand.
s.

Boy, have I been there (many times)

[Jerry G]

someone told me once that it's the indian, not the arrow.

I would be in favor of the rule change to slow down the turkey dance. Them little suckers can really move fast to duck a bullet.

[OldRanger]

I can't find the picture right now, but didn't someone win a match shooting a rifle from a chunk of 2x4 duct taped to his action?

[Dee]

Not sure if Charlie won but I think he did beat people with regular old rifles lol. If I recall correctly he built this custom rig with the intent of showing people it isn't so much the rifle as it is the trigger man that matter the most. Note the baling wire and hose clamps along with the duct tape. Quality craftsmanship Pharr and Evelio would be envious of



Personally being tall I like shooting down at targets from an elevated platform as if allows my to pull my arm in tighter to my ribs and get into a more locked down position due to having to put my stock holding hand further down the stock thus lowering my elbow to lay more flush against my ribs. The only place I have shot where the targets are somewhat elevated is in Zwolle High Power match at the Ram line which produces the opposite affect as I can only bring my hand so far back on the stock which in turn pulls my arm away from the ribs. You just have to learn to adjust to these changes and that takes practice.


Dee

[OldRanger]

Thats the one! I'm the opposite of that, I'll be the best outfitted B shooter on the line!

[jaja]

[quote="Dee"]
The little short women with hips can really get a good rest on the elbow to the hip when they kick it out there. Just the way it goes and one of the best does this but she doesn't always win, just most of the time.

This supports my point. Its a different shooting platform as opposed to shooting off the rib cage. It affords better stability. Why do you think they choose to do it that way? In any case it was an interesting conversation. Thank you all for your input and insights; that is, perceptions into the true nature of things and as I said when I first started this conversation maybe it's just me.

[malinois]

I have been shooting the silhouette game since 1980 and some here even longer....I shot the chin gun, the standard rifle moded in diffrent ways over the years and the hunter rifle and played with the demensions in an attempt to find some thing that might help...But in the long run after checking all the scores with all 3 guns found that I shot them all about the same...So now i shot the hunter only and practice...that did me the most good. Your position will change over time many times...what you like this season you will hate next same for the equipment.....Shoot what you got..practice as much as you can...mainly put the time in and have fun. If it stops being fun all the rule changes wont help you one dam bit.

[DennisC]

"If it stops being fun all the rule changes wont help you one dam bit."

What he said...

[Dee]

Jaja. The women I am referring to have been shooting all their lives and some were potential Olympians. They practice to be as good as they are my man. It isn't just that they can get a elbow on the hip that allows them to win. One has told us she spends around 75-80 percent of her time dry firing. And she has ammo sponsors and even SELLS ammo herself. So that should give you an idea of how it is practice more than physical dimensions that makes you a winner. They could probably use a shotgun hold without anything touching their torso and beat most people

Just go shoot and have fun hearing the steel pink and watching the animals fall. If you think you are at a disadvantage before you even try that right there is going to be your biggest disadvantage. The mere thought that you are shooting with one to start off is going to affect you more than hip or ribs Its a mental game as much as anything.

Dee