.308 for HP

[chuck d]

.308 use to be King, in the day, right?

I know 6mm and 6.5mm and 7mm give a bit better BC and accuracy, but we are talking offhand, not off rest.
I am sure another reason .308 fell from grace is recoil. But if you shoot a 175 7-08 and a 175 .308, what are you saving in recoil and gaining in accuracy?

If you shot a .308 and used 150 match bullets to 375M and 175match at 550M would you not hold your own from an accuracy standpoint and take the same beating as a 7-08?

Granted the 6.5 will beat in both. But a 6mm will beat you less and ring more rams?

Thanks for your thoughts.
chuck

[Trent]

Loaded with the same bullet weight and velocity I cannot feel the difference between 7-08 and .308.

Why use 175 grain bullets though. 168 grainers seem to carry plenty of energy for the rams. I was using 154 grain Hornady SST bullets in my 7-08 last month and none of the rams stayed standing. I mean... as long as I hit them.

I'll let the "old guys" give a definitive answer though.

[Jerry G]

The weight of the bullet, weight of the gun, and velocity all being equal, the deciding factor is the weight of the powder. More powder, more recoil.

[savagefan]

I prefer the .308 over the 7mm-08 FWIW. I've used both and had more ringers with the 7 (sloppy shooting) than with the .308. Recoil with either round shooting off-hand is so mild it is not a factor.

[yankee]

One of the reasons we got away from the 308 is the recoil. The other is lost amimals. The other is balistics.
You will loose more rams with a 308 either 168, 180 or 190 than you will with a 708 with either a 168 or 175.
One of the things we picked up with the change to 708 was the better bullet flight, less elevation for equal velocity and less wind drift.
This really stands out when switching to the 6.5 with the 140 running around 2600 where you get almost 1/2 the wind drift as a 308 168.
The bottom line. The 708 with a 168 or 175 is hard to beat for ram knockdown. The 6.5 has a little less recoil but you will loose a ram or two.

[RBriscoe]

Chuck,

I don't know where you shoot and that is something to consider in choosing a cartridge.

Chad is absolutely 100% correct in his analysis of the .308 Win. It is inferior to the 7-08 in any way you want to compare it. In my experience, the .308 Win is also not as much fun to shoot (especially in a 9 pound rifle), which is not to be overlooked. This is a game and it is supposed to be fun. The 7-08 can put more energy on target than a .308 Win with a lesser probability of a miss due to not accurately "doping the wind" and all of this with less punishment delivered to you.

There are still people who say that recoil doesn't bother them, but I have yet to encounter someone who says that recoil makes them shoot better. Perhaps I just haven't asked the right person.

The real decision point is whether you want a 6.5mm. They shoot wonderfully with even less wind drift and recoil than a 7-08, but it comes at the price of lost rams at some ranges. If you shoot at those ranges, the 7-08 would seem to be the clear choice. Frankly, a 7-08 is hard to go wrong with...and this from a person who really likes 6.5s.

You might want to visit with some of the people at the ranges where you expect to shoot and ask their opinions about range conditions and so on. You could probably get to shoot some of their rifles and judge things for yourself, but remember that recoil adds up over the course of a day. It is not a matter of a few shots, but many.

With all due respect for the few remaining .308 Win shooters, the day of the .308 Win has passed.

RIP .308 Win.

Rick


P.S. Go play with the numbers at JBM Ballistics.

[mordecai]

The real decision point is whether you want a 6.5mm. They shoot wonderfully with even less wind drift and recoil than a 7-08, but it comes at the price of lost rams at some ranges. If you shoot at those ranges, the 7-08 would seem to be the clear choice. Frankly, a 7-08 is hard to go wrong with...and this from a person who really likes 6.5s.

At some ranges? What specifically are we talking about? The targets themselves? The stands? Conditions (weather, sun, wind, mud, thermals, altitude)? The inclination from firing-point to target?

Just curious. --MC

[RBriscoe]

Mordecai,

You hit most of the factors. The rails and rams themselves vary quite a lot. They might be thick, bent forward, made out of soft steel or sitting on rails that are not quite level or absorb energy by allowing things to vibrate without tipping over. If the wind is typically behind the rams they can be even tougher.

I am sure others can relate stories of ranges that are simply more difficult than others. These ranges have acquired reputations based upon experience. If shooting at such ranges, a cartridge that works quite well elsewhere may have difficulty with rams and so one should consider these things when selecting a cartridge.

Cheers

Rick

[Jerry G]

There are some ranges where you get a wind on the back side of the sheep and they are damn hard to knock over. Ben Avery and Missoula come to mind.